Can DMs require face masks?
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Posted by elvinlord
#1

In light of the changes in require mask usage what is the stance of gencon with indiviual gms requiring mask?  If I show up to a game and the gms tells me I have to leave unless I wear a mask what are my recourses?  

Posted by reek elvinlord
#2

elvinlord wrote:
In light of the changes in require mask usage what is the stance of gencon with indiviual gms requiring mask?  If I show up to a game and the gms tells me I have to leave unless I wear a mask what are my recourses?  

Putting on a mask and playing so you don't make other people feel uncomfortable.  A little self sacrifice is always a good trait in human beings.

Posted by kevinrg elvinlord
#3

elvinlord wrote:
In light of the changes in require mask usage what is the stance of gencon with indiviual gms requiring mask?  If I show up to a game and the gms tells me I have to leave unless I wear a mask what are my recourses?  

Gencon policy should be the 'law of the land' for the event.    Not sure it is a good idea for GMs to have the ability to enforce their own health standards. 

If you don't think they are doing enough or you think they are doing too much and your own standards/expectations don't match their policy, then don't go or host events.

Posted by cinnibar
#4

From the Event Host Policy:
GEN CON STAFF IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ENFORCING CONVENTION POLICIES Just like with badge requirements or other convention policies, event organizers and GMs should remind attendees about the rules they should follow but are not responsible for directly enforcing them with attendees. If a participant in any of your events refuses to follow convention policies, makes your staff or other participants uncomfortable, or puts anyone in any danger, immediately contact Gen Con staff and event team members to deal with the problem.

It goes on that a GM has a problematic player or security issue, to also bring over Gen Con staff.

note: the easiest solution to everyone's problem is to simply refund your ticket instead of 'forcing' the GM or player to interact.

Posted by elvinlord reek
#5

reek wrote:
elvinlord wrote:
In light of the changes in require mask usage what is the stance of gencon with individual gms requiring mask?  If I show up to a game and the gms tells me I have to leave unless I wear a mask what are my recourses?  
Putting on a mask and playing so you don't make other people feel uncomfortable.  A little self sacrifice is always a good trait in human beings.
I just want to know if there is a official ruling and if that is going to clearly communicated.  I would really like it to not be the wild west with individuals making there own rules up on the spot.  If the ruling is yes DMs can require mask usage with no prior notice it could influence peoples desire to attend the con or choice of games.  Really no looking to have the "you not wear mask you bad person" discussion.

Posted by elvinlord cinnibar
#6

cinnibar wrote:
From the Event Host Policy:
GEN CON STAFF IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ENFORCING CONVENTION POLICIES Just like with badge requirements or other convention policies, event organizers and GMs should remind attendees about the rules they should follow but are not responsible for directly enforcing them with attendees. If a participant in any of your events refuses to follow convention policies, makes your staff or other participants uncomfortable, or puts anyone in any danger, immediately contact Gen Con staff and event team members to deal with the problem.
It goes on that a GM has a problematic player or security issue, to also bring over Gen Con staff.
note: the easiest solution to everyone's problem is to simply refund your ticket instead of 'forcing' the GM or player to interact.
Yes but the rule is gencon recommends mask usage but is not requiring it.  Allowing DMs to create new gencon rules on the spot is just bad.  If it is now going to ok for DMs to consider you a problematic person and make a big scene if you dont want to wear a mask there will be chaos and bad feelings all around.

Posted by fethbone
#7

My hope would be that GMs are not allowed to make their own rules on this matter, as the current policy clearly states that masks are optional if you have a proof-of-vaccination bracelet. Attendees, including GMs, should be aware of this and thus anticipate and consider their comfort level at being around people who are not wearing masks in advance. 

However, I agree that it would be nice to have an official statement confirming (or refuting) that a GM/EO cannot require someone with a proof-of-vax bracelet to wear a mask at their event/game.

Posted by squirecam fethbone
#8

fethbone wrote:
My hope would be that GMs are not allowed to make their own rules on this matter, as the current policy clearly states that masks are optional if you have a proof-of-vaccination bracelet. Attendees, including GMs, should be aware of this and thus anticipate and consider their comfort level at being around people who are not wearing masks in advance. 
However, I agree that it would be nice to have an official statement confirming (or refuting) that a GM/EO cannot require someone with a proof-of-vax bracelet to wear a mask at their event/game.
The GM could be having cancer treatments for all you know. If it was a game I wanted to play and everyone else agreed to wear a mask I would just do so. 

Or you could insist on staying without a mask and probably have a bad time. Hope it's not a game where cooperation is required. Or you might find people unwilling to trade that wheat for sheep.

Have some common courtesy and everything will work out fine. 

Posted by elvinlord squirecam
#9

squirecam wrote:
fethbone wrote:
My hope would be that GMs are not allowed to make their own rules on this matter, as the current policy clearly states that masks are optional if you have a proof-of-vaccination bracelet. Attendees, including GMs, should be aware of this and thus anticipate and consider their comfort level at being around people who are not wearing masks in advance. 
However, I agree that it would be nice to have an official statement confirming (or refuting) that a GM/EO cannot require someone with a proof-of-vax bracelet to wear a mask at their event/game.
The GM could be having cancer treatments for all you know. If it was a game I wanted to play and everyone else agreed to wear a mask I would just do so. Or you could insist on staying without a mask and probably have a bad time. Hope it's not a game where cooperation is required. Or you might find people unwilling to trade that wheat for sheep.
Have some common courtesy and everything will work out fine. 
If someone is having cancer treatments why would they be at a game convention?  That would kind of be the last place to be even with basic con crud.  Your point is exactly why I would like a upfront confirmation.  If I sign up to a 8 Hour roleplay session and suprise you now have to wear a mask thats eight ways to not fun.  I am soft spoken and while I can project it rags my voice out and masks pretty much muffle me enough that I have to project.   Ya I dont play coop games with a one player win mechanic that promotes king making, settlers of catan if a trash game IMHO.

Posted by elvinlord squirecam
#10

squirecam wrote:
fethbone wrote:
My hope would be that GMs are not allowed to make their own rules on this matter, as the current policy clearly states that masks are optional if you have a proof-of-vaccination bracelet. Attendees, including GMs, should be aware of this and thus anticipate and consider their comfort level at being around people who are not wearing masks in advance. 
However, I agree that it would be nice to have an official statement confirming (or refuting) that a GM/EO cannot require someone with a proof-of-vax bracelet to wear a mask at their event/game.
The GM could be having cancer treatments for all you know. If it was a game I wanted to play and everyone else agreed to wear a mask I would just do so. Or you could insist on staying without a mask and probably have a bad time. Hope it's not a game where cooperation is required. Or you might find people unwilling to trade that wheat for sheep.
Have some common courtesy and everything will work out fine. 
You could also have the opposite situation where 5 people sign up for a game, 4 sign up thinking masks are going to optional, the 5th throws a fit until the DM just says fine everyone has to wear a mask, think that 5th player is going to have a good time.  More I think about it this year is going to be a real poop show. 

Posted by squirecam elvinlord
#11

elvinlord wrote:
squirecam wrote:
fethbone wrote:
My hope would be that GMs are not allowed to make their own rules on this matter, as the current policy clearly states that masks are optional if you have a proof-of-vaccination bracelet. Attendees, including GMs, should be aware of this and thus anticipate and consider their comfort level at being around people who are not wearing masks in advance. 
However, I agree that it would be nice to have an official statement confirming (or refuting) that a GM/EO cannot require someone with a proof-of-vax bracelet to wear a mask at their event/game.
The GM could be having cancer treatments for all you know. If it was a game I wanted to play and everyone else agreed to wear a mask I would just do so. Or you could insist on staying without a mask and probably have a bad time. Hope it's not a game where cooperation is required. Or you might find people unwilling to trade that wheat for sheep.
Have some common courtesy and everything will work out fine. 
You could also have the opposite situation where 5 people sign up for a game, 4 sign up thinking masks are going to optional, the 5th throws a fit until the DM just says fine everyone has to wear a mask, think that 5th player is going to have a good time.  More I think about it this year is going to be a real poop show. 
I plan to have fun playing games. Masked up makes no difference to me.

And the fifth guy in your example is better off not playing in that game. Simple respect and going along with the majority seems the better option.

Posted by cinnibar
#12

Let me clarify the above since you missed an important point:

 If a participant in any of your events refuses to follow convention policies, makes your staff or other participants uncomfortable, 

So you see, yes, the GM can indeed choose what makes them comfortable or not.

Sorry!

Posted by kevinrg cinnibar
#13


So you see, yes, the GM can indeed choose what makes them comfortable or not.Sorry!

GM's creating arbitrary health and safety standards for themselves and their event doesn't seem like a good idea.

That starts happening, I'll just excuse myself, say 'Have fun guys' and see about getting a potential refund and finding something else to do during that time slot.

 

Posted by elvinlord cinnibar
#14

cinnibar wrote:
Let me clarify the above since you missed an important point:
 If a participant in any of your events refuses to follow convention policies, makes your staff or other participants uncomfortable, 

So you see, yes, the GM can indeed choose what makes them comfortable or not.Sorry!

Good point I wonder if will go both ways and DMs who decide people insisting on mask wearing are the ones making participants uncomfortable and boot them from the game.  It would be nice if they could have a tag on events which indicate if the DM will require masks or not.  Really they just need to go back to masks for everyone period.   Makes things nice and clear.

Posted by elvinlord kevinrg
#15

kevinrg wrote:

So you see, yes, the GM can indeed choose what makes them comfortable or not.Sorry!

GM's creating arbitrary health and safety standards for themselves and their event doesn't seem like a good idea.That starts happening, I'll just excuse myself, say 'Have fun guys' and see about getting a potential refund and finding something else to do during that time slot.
 
Yeah fortunately over the years I have only had to bail once on a game like that.  Hopefully this year Gencon will follow a extra generous refund policy to account for people being drama lamas on both sides.

Posted by boute001
#16

So can a dm claim they feel uncomfortable playing with a person not vaccinated even if they wear a mask by your rational?

Posted by matthias9
#17

Since you've said you aren't coming, maybe just let us do our thing without trying to throw a wrench in the gears. 

We will be fine, I assure you. 

Gen Con staff are competent and attendees are overwhelmingly reasonable. 

 

Posted by boute001
#18

Way to deflect a legitimate question and reconfirming why I’m making the right decision to skip.  Thanks!

Posted by elvinlord matthias9
#19

matthias9 wrote:
Since you've said you aren't coming, maybe just let us do our thing without trying to throw a wrench in the gears. 
We will be fine, I assure you. 
Gen Con staff are competent and attendees are overwhelmingly reasonable. 
 
Yes hopefully people will be reasonable and people that have to/want to wear a mask sit down at the game table and don't make a fuss if there are people who don't have too/cannot wear a mask at the same table.  I guess time will tell.

Posted by cinnibar
#20

Again.  Read the policy, you keep reading new words into it.

The GM calls over staff to handle the issue, they do not actively 'boot' or 'kick' people...they leave that to others.  But once they do, granted, it is unlikely the GM and player want to play with each other and I suspect a refund coming.

The policy also notes if a player objects to the material and/or content of the game, the GM can note this on the back of the ticket (or send an email) and send the player to Customer Service to obtain a refund.

 

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