How long to wait before taking generics?
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Posted by tomorrow1969

Inevitably, there is always one person who does not show up for the event.  How long should you wait before accepting a generic for that event?  In the past I have waited 15 minutes (that's what we did in college before we assumed the prof wasn't going to show up).  Also, if the person holding the original ticket shows up 40 minutes late (or thereabouts) and insists on playing, what do you do?  I have not had this specific thing happen, but I can see where it might.  Any thoughts?

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Posted by firvulag

Every event I've ever played at GenCon waits 10 minutes.  This is my first year running events and that's my intention as well.

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Posted by garhkal

For sparks, we do the 10 min thing too..  BUT prefer to start as close to the time as possible.

As for what to do when the ticket holder DOES show up..  Sorry bub..  you're too late. 
Now you COULD be nice and take HIS ticket, and give generics for it..  But its not required.

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Posted by tomorrow1969

Now you COULD be nice and take HIS ticket, and give generics for it..  But its not required.

That's great.  It would make a bad sitaution a little better.

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Posted by derekguder

It depends on the event.

We encourage waiting up to 15 minutes for late folks to show up, assuming the event can accommodate that kind of delay.

If you need to start on time, however, either because it's a tight tournament or you have an RPG that is already packing a lot into 4 hours or whatever else, you can technically start right on time, if necessary.

In short, if a player shows up late, they're late. It is a courtesy to wait for them to arrive and you should extend it whenever you can, but it is not a requirement.

(though if we get lots of complaints it happens with all your events, we'll suggest just submitting a longer session to account for that)

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Derek Guder
Event Manager
Gen Con LLC

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Posted by derekguder tomorrow1969

tomorrow1969 wrote:
Now you COULD be nice and take HIS ticket, and give generics for it..  But its not required.

That's great.  It would make a bad sitaution a little better.


No, do not give change for event tickets under any circumstance.

In this case, if the registered player shows up just after you started and it's too late, then they can just go to customer service and try to get a refund for it. Tell the local HQ that they just missed it and they should be taken care of.

But do not trade tickets.

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Derek Guder
Event Manager
Gen Con LLC

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Posted by ckell

I have had it happen.  This is actually covered in the rules you get as a GM when you agree to the contract.  I believe it is 15 minutes.  What I do is begin an introduction to the game which takes 5 minutes.  I then take the tickets at the table.  If they are all present, I move on.  If I get generics, and I always do, I tell them that I must wait until 15 after start time.  We start the game.  If the boob shows up late and it is within 15 minutes, I explain that I have space in the game for more players.  I allow a vote.  If so much as one person has a problem with it, the generic tickets go back and I take the ticket.  If they are all ok, I welcome both and the game starts.  I have never had a problem.  I set games for 8 players but we have as many at 10.  Once I had 3 ticketed folks and 5 with generics.   

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Posted by watchdog ckell

ckell wrote:
I have had it happen.  This is actually covered in the rules you get as a GM when you agree to the contract.  I believe it is 15 minutes.  What I do is begin an introduction to the game which takes 5 minutes.  I then take the tickets at the table.  If they are all present, I move on.  If I get generics, and I always do, I tell them that I must wait until 15 after start time.  We start the game.  If the boob shows up late and it is within 15 minutes, I explain that I have space in the game for more players.  I allow a vote.  If so much as one person has a problem with it, the generic tickets go back and I take the ticket.  If they are all ok, I welcome both and the game starts.  I have never had a problem.  I set games for 8 players but we have as many at 10.  Once I had 3 ticketed folks and 5 with generics.   
I see a couple of problems with this approach.

1. In RPG events, some people have a definite comfort level when it comes to playing with a specific number of other players.  For example, they think six is perfect but eight is too many.  They may have signed up for your event in part because it was listed as having a maximum of X players.

2.  By having the players vote, you're putting a player with that comfort level in a very awkward position. Either they speak up and have to take the role of the stick in the mud objecting to the extra player hoping to get in, or they say nothing and have a less than optimal gaming experience. 

If you can run the game with as many as ten, I would list it that way in the catalog. If nothing else, you would get two tables to work with instead of trying to crowd ten people plus you around one standard Gen Con round table. 

 

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Posted by garhkal derekguder

derekguder wrote:
tomorrow1969 wrote:
Now you COULD be nice and take HIS ticket, and give generics for it..  But its not required.

That's great.  It would make a bad sitaution a little better.

No, do not give change for event tickets under any circumstance.In this case, if the registered player shows up just after you started and it's too late, then they can just go to customer service and try to get a refund for it. Tell the local HQ that they just missed it and they should be taken care of.
But do not trade tickets.
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Derek Guder
Event Manager
Gen Con LLC

Rgr that.. 

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Posted by ckell watchdog

watchdog wrote:
ckell wrote:
I have had it happen.  This is actually covered in the rules you get as a GM when you agree to the contract.  I believe it is 15 minutes.  What I do is begin an introduction to the game which takes 5 minutes.  I then take the tickets at the table.  If they are all present, I move on.  If I get generics, and I always do, I tell them that I must wait until 15 after start time.  We start the game.  If the boob shows up late and it is within 15 minutes, I explain that I have space in the game for more players.  I allow a vote.  If so much as one person has a problem with it, the generic tickets go back and I take the ticket.  If they are all ok, I welcome both and the game starts.  I have never had a problem.  I set games for 8 players but we have as many at 10.  Once I had 3 ticketed folks and 5 with generics.   
I see a couple of problems with this approach.1. In RPG events, some people have a definite comfort level when it comes to playing with a specific number of other players.  For example, they think six is perfect but eight is too many.  They may have signed up for your event in part because it was listed as having a maximum of X players.
2.  By having the players vote, you're putting a player with that comfort level in a very awkward position. Either they speak up and have to take the role of the stick in the mud objecting to the extra player hoping to get in, or they say nothing and have a less than optimal gaming experience. 
If you can run the game with as many as ten, I would list it that way in the catalog. If nothing else, you would get two tables to work with instead of trying to crowd ten people plus you around one standard Gen Con round table. 
I see what you are saying, but I take a secret ballot, no one is ever put on the spot, and they get to voice that opinion privately.  Again, I see your points, but in this case they just do not apply.  The people who buy my tickets, are fun people who enjoy the sprint of GenCon.  13 years running and never a problem.  
   There are a limited number of tickets, and I have people contact me every year, who were unable to get tickets.  So before the game starts, I end up planning for a few more players.  I have about 5 people who buy my tickets year over year, kind of a fan club, and toward the end of the games, folks from other rooms and our room, gather around the table cheering players on to the last.  So it depends on what kind of game you run.  In the end, its about having fun.  No one has eve left my table upset or feeling cheated. 

Tables?  We use as many as 3 tables.  There is always enough room.   

Last thought here.  I think that players who show up late are rude.  Rude to everyone else the that table.  But I get it, and it is GenCon.  Its about having fun.  I do what works for me and the players and I have made a lot of great friends at the tables at GenCon.  Do what works for you, right? 

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Posted by zelgar ckell

ckell wrote:Last thought here.  I think that players who show up late are rude.  Rude to everyone else the that table.  But I get it, and it is GenCon.  Its about having fun.  I do what works for me and the players and I have made a lot of great friends at the tables at GenCon.  Do what works for you, right?
On the rudeness angle, the worst players are the ones who sign up for an event and never show up.  I don't know how many times I've had to wait for 15 minutes for people to show up for an event that was supposedly filled and only a few people show up.  I hate it when people are searching for a game with generics go away while you're waiting for people with tickets to show up during that 15 minute window.

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Posted by brotherbock derekguder

 
derekguder wrote:
tomorrow1969 wrote:
Now you COULD be nice and take HIS ticket, and give generics for it..  But its not required.

That's great.  It would make a bad sitaution a little better.

No, do not give change for event tickets under any circumstance.In this case, if the registered player shows up just after you started and it's too late, then they can just go to customer service and try to get a refund for it. Tell the local HQ that they just missed it and they should be taken care of.
But do not trade tickets.
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Derek Guder
Event Manager
Gen Con LLC

Doesn't it not matter anyway, because that ticket they have for the game they just missed can be used as a generic ticket for any event of the same cost, right?

(Agreed on not making change, just saying that their ticket is not useless to them, correct?)

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Posted by parody brotherbock

Technically true, but if you're like me and schedule your weekend out (and thus haven't used generics for years) it's effectively useless.

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Posted by garhkal zelgar

zelgar wrote:
ckell wrote:Last thought here.  I think that players who show up late are rude.  Rude to everyone else the that table.  But I get it, and it is GenCon.  Its about having fun.  I do what works for me and the players and I have made a lot of great friends at the tables at GenCon.  Do what works for you, right?
On the rudeness angle, the worst players are the ones who sign up for an event and never show up.  I don't know how many times I've had to wait for 15 minutes for people to show up for an event that was supposedly filled and only a few people show up.  I hate it when people are searching for a game with generics go away while you're waiting for people with tickets to show up during that 15 minute window.

If it was already close to that 15 min mark, i would be tempted to tell those generic folks, to go ahead and take a seat!  And if the 'ticket holders DO show up', tell them sorry, you are too late...

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Posted by watchdog brotherbock

 

Doesn't it not matter anyway, because that ticket they have for the game they just missed can be used as a generic ticket for any event of the same cost, right?(Agreed on not making change, just saying that their ticket is not useless to them, correct?)
One difference is that if the player's event ticket is say $12, he could enter three $4 events without having to purchase additional tickets if he was allowed to exchange it for generics.  

 

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Posted by brotherbock parody

parody wrote:
Technically true, but if you're like me and schedule your weekend out (and thus haven't used generics for years) it's effectively useless.

But then generic tickets are useless to you as well. 

My point is just that any event ticket is a generic ticket for a game of the same cost. So making change with generics is unnecessary. 

Watchdog, that's a good point. But still not allowed :) 

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Posted by watchdog

I know it's not allowed.  My point IMO is one of the reasons why.

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Posted by brotherbock watchdog

watchdog wrote:
I know it's not allowed.  My point IMO is one of the reasons why.

Yeah, I knew what you meant. I was just trying to make sure my own post didn't come across as approving. :) 

I still think tickets for events that are over shouldn't be usable for other events. Give people incentive to return them. 

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