new health update:
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Posted by sovietprince

Just read feb update and it's got me worried, I am a big pro vax and mask type of person but why does the limits seem worse then last years when cases are on the downswing? The virus will always be with us in some compacity and if we wait on it going away will be wearing mask forever. 

I also get that guidence can change but will it change in time for venders that choose to pass on last year to reassess there willingness to go or not? Last year was underwelming for us (though I do understand why that year) I missed the fANTASY flights and upper deck tier venders. 

I get why it was done last year not complaning about that, i just don't see why restrictions are getting tighter when things so far look to be going in the right direction. 

PS: I do appreciate the event staff this is not meant to bash but to share a concern

Posted by chaoticneutral262

I think they are basically saying, worst case, this is what to expect.  If conditions allow, they may relax the requirements.

Omicron is declining rapidly and the CDC is expected to update masking recommendations in the next week or so.  I think it is very likely that they will say it is okay for vaccinated people to forego masking as long as severe disease and hospitalizations are below a certain threshold.  Cross your fingers!

I wouldn't expect Gen Con to set their final policy until the convention date is near.  As Omicron showed us, things can change rapidly.

Posted by donaldbain

It's easier to relax restriction closer to the con than to add new ones. 

Posted by sovietprince donaldbain

donaldbain wrote:t's easier to relax restriction closer to the con than to add new ones. 
I just wonder how it will effect vender attendenceot

Posted by brumcg sovietprince

sovietprince wrote:I just wonder how it will effect vender attendenceot

Those decisions have already been made for the most part.  IIRC, 2/4 was a big deadline for exhibitors.

I've seen some past exhibitors who are still holding back this year due to the virus (not Gen Con's policies).  I also suspect that companies without a US office may have made a decision not to attend. 

Posted by lemauxjw

New CDC report showing that natural immunity was more effective than just the vaccine alone protecting against Delta COVID.  

While I 100% agree and believe that getting the vaccine is the prudent decision and will offer the greatest protection once you’ve been exposed to the natural virus, Gencon management has to acknowledge the impact that natural immunity has on one’s ability to manage and recover from the worst of COVID-19.   

Also, given the extremely high Ro factor for omicron, it is highly likely that everyone will have been exposed and have some level of immunity by August.   To keep the vaccine mandate in place goes against the latest science and is a blatant political move trying to coerce other to Gencon leadership’s worldview.   

Follow the science - do the right thing.  It’s time to stop living with Coronaphobia.  

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7104e1.htm
 

Posted by brumcg lemauxjw

lemauxjw wrote:To keep the vaccine mandate in place goes against the latest science and is a blatant political move trying to coerce other to Gencon leadership’s worldview.

I can only guess that you wanted this thread locked.

Posted by lemauxjw brumcg

brumcg wrote:
lemauxjw wrote:To keep the vaccine mandate in place goes against the latest science and is a blatant political move trying to coerce other to Gencon leadership’s worldview.

I can only guess that you wanted this thread locked.
I guess we’ll have to keep banging our heads against the wall until Gencon leadership opens up their view of where we’re at currently based on the latest science.  

Posted by matthias9

I'm puzzled by this philosophy.  So the best way to avoid getting covid is to .... get covid?  Ok...

Also, people really need to stop cherry picking one study and claiming it is "the science".

As was just pointed out, that only leads to the same scientific debate that gets these threads locked.   This isn't the place to debate the science. 

Thumbs up to vaccine requirement -- (just like has been required at my college, for the Peace Corps, military and more for decades).

[Thumbs down to a mask requirement.]

Posted by brumcg lemauxjw

lemauxjw wrote:I guess we’ll have to keep banging our heads against the wall until Gencon leadership opens up their view of where we’re at currently based on the latest science.  

Okay, there's the disconnect.

Gen Con has been crystal clear that they aren't considering the current state of things.  Their entire focus is on August.

Hope for the best, expect the worst, take what comes (probably in late July).

Posted by kevinrg

Really don't get the point of threads like this since they always get locked down.  I have my own line of policy.  If Gencon does that, I'll attend, If Gencon doesn't meet that, I won't attend.  

I'll worry about that when I have to (which is before there is any major financial implications for me).

At this time, I'll bet in late May timeframe, we will see a survey about 'Will you still attend if' and then lay out scenarios with mask/no mask, vaccine/no vaccine type questions to gauge policies outside of any state/local/CDC type requirements.

Posted by lemauxjw matthias9

 

Posted by lemauxjw lemauxjw

lemauxjw wrote:
matthias9 wrote:
I'm puzzled by this philosophy.  So the best way to avoid getting covid is to .... get covid?  Ok...
Also, people really need to stop cherry picking one study and claiming it is "the science".
As was just pointed out, that only leads to the same scientific debate that gets these threads locked.   This isn't the place to debate the science. 
Thumbs up to vaccine requirement -- (just like has been required at my college, for the Peace Corps, military and more for decades).
[Thumbs down to a mask requirement.]

Fact #1: You're going to get exposed to the coronavirus which causes COVID-19.  None of us can "avoid" the Coronavirus for ever. 

Fact #2: The best way to protect yourself against COVID is by training your immune systems to respond to the disease.  The safest way to do that is by exposing it to the vaccine.  However, you also build resistance by exposing your immune system to the Coronavirus.  It's more dangerous, but, if you survive, you do carry resistance against the disease (as the CDC study shows)

Fact #3: Sharing a CDC report isn't cherry picking.  I would consider the CDC the premier body for this type of opinion in the United States - more so than Fox News, CNN, MSNBC, etc.  The CDC, along with peer reviewed articles in well-respected medical journals, are the best sources of information like this, especially when it's supported by studies involving large amounts of data.  However, these findings may become dated as the virus evolves (i.e., mutates) and as more data becomes available.  I think it's reasonable to share information from these sources to help disseminate the information as our understanding continues to develop.

I would rather not have this be a scientific discussion.  However, given what Gencon leadership stated in the release yesterday and how it goes against what the data published by the CDC is saying, I think it's only fair to bring it to their attention.

Also, I frankly don't give a damn if they lock the thread.  This is a conversation that needs to occur and also needs to be an ongoing conversation as the con approaches.  It doesn't matter if it's uncomfortable for the mods, or paints the decisions made by GC leadership in a bad light.  

However, we all need to be respectful of one another, of what our accumulated understanding of the virus is, and the rights in this country for individuals to make their own personal decisions.

Posted by mikeboozer

We are not going to debate the science here. Further posts will be locked/deleted.

The issue is not with the conversation about what we should or should not do. However it really is superfluous at this time try and debate it as the convention is too far away to know what the final policy will be.

The issue is that these discussions are devolving into disrespectful shouting matches about who is right and who is wrong about the science.
 
We will be using our own sources to determine what should be done for the health and welfare of our attendees.
It is better to start with a more restrictive policy and see how things develop in the world then it is to do the opposite. 

"I would rather not have this be a scientific discussion.  However, given what Gencon leadership stated in the release yesterday and how it goes against what the data published by the CDC is saying, I think it's only fair to bring it to their attention."

There is need to bring it to our attention, we are monitoring this and other sources.

We'll leave the thread open for now, but I'm not optimistic.

Mike 

Posted by mikeboozer

To address the concern about vendors.

We are of course in contact with all of them. They by in large understand what we are doing and why we are doing it.

The turn out to this point has been very encouraging. Can't say much else about that.

Mike

Posted by brumcg mikeboozer

mikeboozer wrote:The turn out to this point has been very encouraging. Can't say much else about that.

This is great news!  Thanks, Mike.

Posted by sovietprince mikeboozer

mikeboozer wrote:
To address the concern about vendors.
We are of course in contact with all of them. They by in large understand what we are doing and why we are doing it.
The turn out to this point has been very encouraging. Can't say much else about that.
Mike

Thanks for responding it's all i ask from the higher ups is to "peacefully" discuss concerns one may have. If things go like they are now I hope that a lot of restrictions are dropped, but if it got worse I all for the rest. Don't want anyone to thing I am against vaccines and mask I am not I just think we don't need to take a cannon to kill a rabit if it's a rabbit come aug.

I am reassured though by your post 

Posted by urielblue

Mike, thanks for your patience with everyone, both those decrying whatever the current rules regarding safety are, as well as those asking questions about vendors, etc... I hope that I speak for many in letting you know how much it is appreciated.

Posted by forar

Anyone who is thinking of attending (and given that badges and housing are time sensitive, that's already underway) should prepare for the worst (in terms of the most stringent restrictions) and accept that we'll be lucky if they're easier than that. As we've seen already, any changes (in terms of going stricter) are immediately met with a backlash, so if nothing else I'd say the event team have been conditioned by a vocal portion of the community's responses to date.

As I've mentioned before, I helped set up one of the largest booths at last year's con (in a mask), ran demos for all 4 days (in a mask) and then helped with tear down (in a mask).

It's not an ideal experience, but it's hardly being tossed in a pit full of broken glass either.

If being fully vaccinated (and boosted) allows for me to avoid that experience this year (safely), great, but I'm lined up to assist once more and expect to be masked at all times (that I'm not eating or drinking, that is), based on nothing said by the event or booth I work at, but my own managed expectations.

This pandemic has had periods where the situation has evolved week by week if not day by day. We're over 5 months out, there's no sensible world in which the event team would commit to relaxed restrictions so far away from showtime. At the earliest I'd hope for some updated guidance relevant to this show sometime in July. Anything before that should (imo) be taken as a guideline that has massive asterisks and "SUBJECT TO CHANGE" appended to every statement and sentiment.

Posted by sovietprince forar

forar wrote:
Anyone who is thinking of attending (and given that badges and housing are time sensitive, that's already underway) should prepare for the worst (in terms of the most stringent restrictions) and accept that we'll be lucky if they're easier than that. As we've seen already, any changes (in terms of going stricter) are immediately met with a backlash, so if nothing else I'd say the event team have been conditioned by a vocal portion of the community's responses to date.
As I've mentioned before, I helped set up one of the largest booths at last year's con (in a mask), ran demos for all 4 days (in a mask) and then helped with tear down (in a mask).
It's not an ideal experience, but it's hardly being tossed in a pit full of broken glass either.
If being fully vaccinated (and boosted) allows for me to avoid that experience this year (safely), great, but I'm lined up to assist once more and expect to be masked at all times (that I'm not eating or drinking, that is), based on nothing said by the event or booth I work at, but my own managed expectations.
This pandemic has had periods where the situation has evolved week by week if not day by day. We're over 5 months out, there's no sensible world in which the event team would commit to relaxed restrictions so far away from showtime. At the earliest I'd hope for some updated guidance relevant to this show sometime in July. Anything before that should (imo) be taken as a guideline that has massive asterisks and "SUBJECT TO CHANGE" appended to every statement and sentiment.

Thing is we have to get back to normal someday and this year we will have vaccines, natural immunity,a less deadly virus, and treatments that did not exist elsewear even Fauci said were on the way to making precautions a personal choice were you decide if the danger is a threat to you or not. Unless things get a whole lot worse I think that is were things are headed. 

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