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Posted by general lopez gsmiley

gsmiley wrote:
The language of the blog post makes it pretty clear that they are going to do their own science and disregard the CDC guidance.

Exactly this is from David's blog post last August for Gencon 2021

"We’re following the guidance of the CDC, and continuing to work with local Indy officials including the Marion County Public Health Department & You may have seen other conventions moving forward with proof of vaccination policies; many of these are based on state or local mandates, which provide legal grounds for requiring vaccinations." 

So it's follow their own science now if they disagree with the current policies. Indiana or Indianapolis have no such vaccine mandates so what legal ground do they have this year, especially after they proved you do not need one, and can still have a safe convention like they did last year in the middle of the delta outbreak.    

Posted by joho

I applaud the caution Gencon is exercising, the vaccine requirement is non-negotiable for my group of a dozen. We would all cancel should it be lifted. 

As we near the Event registration phase I am talking to more and more people to see if they’ll be returning. With an event of tens of thousands in close proximity face to face and rubbing elbows, every one who isn’t attending this year is not comfortable even with the current protections in place. Otherwise I’d be organizing for a group of two dozen. 

The mask requirement makes sense to our group and we’re relieved that it is still in place, hopefully it will stick around this year. Wearing the mask isn’t difficult and we’d rather not risk getting ill mid convention.

with tens of thousands flying in from all over the world and mask requirements stripped from domestic travel and variants that breakthrough and spread at high rates, I’m glad GEncon is exercising caution.

we’re talking about a con where asking for hygiene requirements for attendees is a running joke. Add to that the regular incidents of concrud and asking people to hit some baseline requirements-
vaccination & masking (with limited exception) makes me and my group feel more comfortable in attending.

also, come on- ‘doing their own science’ (eye roll)

Posted by general lopez

joho wrote:I applaud the caution Gencon is exercising, the vaccine requirement is non-negotiable for my group of a dozen. We would all cancel should it be lifted. 

The mask requirement makes sense to our group and we’re relieved that it is still in place, hopefully it will stick around this year. Wearing the mask isn’t difficult and we’d rather not risk getting ill mid convention.

also, come on- ‘doing their own science’ (eye roll)


Unvaccinated people are everywhere so does your group just stay home and not go anywhere? Does your group not plan to leave the convention hall because there will be unvaccinated unmasked people everywhere they go in Indianapolis, hotels, restaurants, etc, not to mention the unvaccinated workers in the ICC, medical exemptions and kids under 5 that your group will be around. Even if there was no mask mandate nothing stops you from wearing one. 

What science are they following if it's not their own, because it sure is not the CDC or the local heath dept like they said they were last year?

Posted by gsmiley joho

joho wrote:
also, come on- ‘doing their own science’ (eye roll)

If they are disregarding the CDC, who's science are they doing then?  Their own.

Posted by joho

I hope they sell the overstock Gencon lab coats from all this science they are doing.

Posted by papabees

I'm beginning to think the policy is simply a CYA legally for them. I mean, think about it, we know that Covid is an air born particle, that even with masks will saturate an average sized room with particulates in about 20 minutes. If one is hacking up flem, or spraying when they speak there is some benefit. Now stuff 50k people in a convention hall. On top of that, down almost half of the main gaming hall last year there was a "mask break" area where one could sit unmasked for hours on end if you desired. It was generally about half full. So it was basically like having a peeing section in a public pool. I'm always amazed at the people who say "we need to do this to be safe" yet voluntarily attend a large event with throngs of people located in a city that basically did away with masking entirely about four months ago (and had no significant breakout, by the way). Covid is not going anywhere. We are going to have it around forever. It's basically the common cold at this point. And yes, people occasionally pass away from catching a cold. It's tragic, but that doesn't mean we stop doing life. As for me, I have yet to spend any money with them, despite them blowing my email up to buy a ticket, because I want to see the final call before I do.

Posted by general lopez papabees

 

sorry double post

Posted by general lopez general lopez

general lopez wrote:
papabees wrote:
I'm beginning to think the policy is simply a CYA legally for them.

Unfortunately it has nothing to do with legally being covered. They do have legal cover, there are no local or state mandates. There have been very large conventions at the ICC with no requirements. PopCon is in 3 weeks with no restrictions. The largest comic convention in the county that is double Gencon's size in one of the most pro mask and vaccine states is going to have less restrictions  They also ran Gencon in a much worse covid environment last year with less restrictions. They had you sign a waiver last year stating its not their fault if you catch covid, attend at your own risk. 

Posted by kevinrg joho

joho wrote:
I hope they sell the overstock Gencon lab coats from all this science they are doing.

I think some people say they are 'doing their own science' they mean they seemingly are constructing their own set of rules on what they want to enforce outside of the stated 'Following the CDC guidelines' from the last year and what other Cons/society are moving towards.   Which their party, their right to do it, but I think they have made the situation more muddled than it needs to be 2 months out.  They really need to establish and move on.   Now they don't even know what 'vaccine required' means so, that confuses it even more.  I'm sure there is a non insignificant group of people that have had the initial shots and have had no boosters (like myself for reasons I am not getting into on a forum because it isn't worth discussing) that are in a unknown state of what they are doing.

As noted in previous posts, I think they are trying to get to mid June so they are confident at what attendance is before carving anything into stone.   If everyone wanted no masks/no vax and attendance was 0 right now, then there would be no masks/vax (or at least some type of rule to get to 50%).  Conversely, if everyone wanted vax/masks and it was sold out, the wishy/washy language that is stringing some along in hopes it will be relaxed would be removed and vax/masks would be carved in stone.

 

Posted by scott_65

How will out of country vaccination status be handled? My group is coming from Canada, so we clearly don't have the same vaccine credentialing system implemented by the CDC.

Posted by kmlorenz scott_65

scott_65 wrote:
How will out of country vaccination status be handled? My group is coming from Canada, so we clearly don't have the same vaccine credentialing system implemented by the CDC.

This is going to be important for a lot of international travelers, and more info about what vaccines will be accepted (astra zenica? Sinovax?) Would be helpful too.

Also will non English forms be accepted? Will official translations be required?

All of that might take people a fair bit of time to get organized, depending on what is considered acceptable.

I'm really hoping someone at gencon will tackle this sooner rather than later.

Posted by dragongears papabees

papabees wrote:
I'm beginning to think the policy is simply a CYA legally for them.

There's nothing wrong with protecting yourself from legal repercussions.

Posted by dragongears

I wonder if the people going on about CDC guidelines were CDC cheerleaders earlier on in the pandemic when guidelines were more strict.

Posted by colbrook dragongears

dragongears wrote:
papabees wrote:
I'm beginning to think the policy is simply a CYA legally for them.

There's nothing wrong with protecting yourself from legal repercussions.
Not just legally, "We want as few people as possible to get sick at our convention" is an admirable moral stance

Posted by cinnibar oldcurmudgeonstudios

oldcurmudgeonstudios wrote:
Oh, and by the way, if it doesn't change THIS year, you might as well get used to the idea of it never going away. Nothing will have changed between this year and next year in terms of contagion rate, or people who are susceptible, or are immuno-compromised. The only thing that will have changed is that people will just get used to the idea of having to mask up at GenCon in perpetuity.
Righ, because things never change, ever.  It's impossible the status quo might update in the future.  Reality just doesn't do that. (sarcasm, yes)

Posted by hahnarama

[This post has been removed]

Posted by mikeboozer cinnibar

cinnibar wrote:
oldcurmudgeonstudios wrote:
Oh, and by the way, if it doesn't change THIS year, you might as well get used to the idea of it never going away. Nothing will have changed between this year and next year in terms of contagion rate, or people who are susceptible, or are immuno-compromised. The only thing that will have changed is that people will just get used to the idea of having to mask up at GenCon in perpetuity.
Righ, because things never change, ever.  It's impossible the status quo might update in the future.  Reality just doesn't do that. (sarcasm, yes)

Everyone take it down a notch please. I have managed to keep this open and I don't want to lock it, or ban peeps.

Mike

Posted by matthias9 dragongears

dragongears wrote:
I wonder if the people going on about CDC guidelines were CDC cheerleaders earlier on in the pandemic when guidelines were more strict.

Wonder no more.  

Actually, it's frustrating going from arguing for people to follow the medical recommendations -- and thinking you're on the side of people who actually follow the scientific and medical advice -- to realizing that it's really just so much tribalism from "my side", too.

It seems like what you are doing is accusing people of hypocrisy.  But, I'm not sure that's a debate you'll want to engage in.

Posted by mikeboozer kmlorenz

kmlorenz wrote:
scott_65 wrote:
How will out of country vaccination status be handled? My group is coming from Canada, so we clearly don't have the same vaccine credentialing system implemented by the CDC.

This is going to be important for a lot of international travelers, and more info about what vaccines will be accepted (astra zenica? Sinovax?) Would be helpful too.Also will non English forms be accepted? Will official translations be required?
All of that might take people a fair bit of time to get organized, depending on what is considered acceptable.
I'm really hoping someone at gencon will tackle this sooner rather than later.

As has been stated before, when we have specific answers to all of these questions we will let you know.

We are gearing all of our processes up. It is still almost 3 months until the convention. 

Mike

Posted by matthias9 hahnarama

[This post has been removed]

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